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May 15, 2007

Question of the Day: Do you know more from the things you taught yourself or from what you learned in school?

Sometimes when people ask me about my background and how I got involved in the things which I got involved with, at some point during the conversation, I confess and tell people that I went to the “Abe Lincoln” school of education since most of the things which I have learned over the years that matter to me, were self-taught rather than studied in school.

As a 12 year old, it was my passion for having a Ham Radio license so that I could speak to people all over the world that lead me to teaching myself Morse Code and somehow learning enough electronic theory to get myself a ham radio license. When I was 14, I got involved in computer programming with a similar passion. On the other hand, I didn’t have much passion in University when I was studying accounting, although I graduated with a BBA in Accounting. My grades in school always reflected my personal interest in a subject. When I was passionate about a topic, I generally did well and when I wasn’t focused, well, I was lucky to make it thru that class. And I’m not sure how much learning took place when I was in class…

Which leads me to today’s question of the day: Looking at what you are involved with these days on a day-to-day basis, did you learn more of what you need to know to do this from something you learned in school, or from something you taught yourself?

Tags: , Jeff Pulver

Posted by jeff on May 15, 2007 07:22 AM | Permalink

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Mostly on my own but it was science fiction books that started me off. For me sci-fi books often put scientific and technological knowledge into a context better than science courses did. Plus the schools operate on the assumption that you are either supposed to be motivated by pleasing the teacher or competition with other students. Neither of those things motivated me.

Finding good books is a major problem though because most are crap.

http://discussions.pbs.org/viewtopic.pbs?p=300610#300610

psik

Posted by: psikeyhackr at July 28, 2007 03:19 PM

My parents taught me early on that learning IS life. This pretty much spoiled me for settling in to any kind of degree program at a university. I could never pick a single field of study, because it always felt too limiting. Somewhere around Junior High I caught the entrepreneurial bug from my father (who had two Ph.Ds, by the way) and decided not to pursue schooling in a formal way. I've probably spent the equivalent of a pricey four-year degree in business pursuits, but I'll put my knowledge up against anyone who is papered.

Posted by: Carter Harkins at May 27, 2007 12:25 PM

I've always said that your education is what you choose to make of it. Sometimes the things you learn on your own are the things that you are the most motivated to go on with and become an expert in. I suspect there is a balance, find something you love to do and use your schooling as a way to network, get guidance from an expert and to make yourself better.

Posted by: Rich Platts at May 18, 2007 04:47 PM

I've learned all of my networking / os knowledge on my own.

The thing the college (at least my engineering school) tought me was how to solve problems and how to think logically.

No school is ever going to teach you 'most of what you need to know'. They will give you the tools you need however to solve problems.

Mike

Posted by: Mike Picher at May 16, 2007 10:23 AM

I attended 7 different colleges so far, and probably won't ever finish a degree unless they give me something like an Oprah degree. Instead, I've collected experience. I've learned from personal interaction. I've experimented in the lab of life.

Most of what I need to do my job falls down to communications skills. I've read voraciously on the topic, and have educated myself through both books and trial-and-error. So far, I feel my education is a good one, though there are times when I wish I had a few basic college skills under my belt, such as maybe accounting, etc.

Posted by: Chris Brogan... at May 16, 2007 09:50 AM

As an entrepreneur with ADD I hardly learned anything in school. I was earning more from my candy locker business in High-School then some of my teachers :)

Even though most of what I have learned has been from business books like anything and everything from Seth Godin, I have learned the most from experience. Just dive in and do and you will learn because you have no choice if you want to be successful.

Posted by: Richard Kligman at May 16, 2007 07:22 AM

I'd have to say that both are important in what I do. For me it has more to do with passion.

Although I rarely think that I "use" what I learned in elementary school (I taught myself to read before 1st grade, I learned how to do math from friends of the family) there definitely are some foundation pieces laid on how to study and even areas of interest from there. (I had a _great_ science teacher.) Of course I was in a private school from K-6. The foundations are rarely something we think of but may be what we form our self learning desires from.

That said - my initial college experience was awful, I learned little other than an enjoyment of Constitutional Law, my knowledge of computers is self learned, even if I did have the advantage of an open access system at the University (ucscb.ucsc.edu).

But then to swing back to the schooling side, I recently went back to school for a Masters degree. And the schooling was wonderful. (There was passion there) There are so many little gaps in knowledge that can occur in self learning and applying and the classes were great for filling it in. But...this was also an all online school - much of the learning came in the discussion and exchange between the students, so my "formal learning" was being enhanced by the experience of the other students who had skill sets other than mine.

So I think I really take from both, and neither can stand on their own.

Posted by: Goldie Katsu at May 15, 2007 05:21 PM

yo jeff -

the more i learn the more i realize how little i know and even more how much less i knew - i have learned mostly from making mistakes lots of mistakes - and always hunting for those good mistakes - i think we learn most from the circumstances we find ourselves in and the defining moments on our life while were thought we were doing something else - i like robert wilsons quote - if you think you are going in the wrong direction then go there - rather then going to where you know the results - as my mother said when i asked her how old she felt inside - she said "not yet born yet" we have so much to learn and explore and yes too share - we are all students and teachers at the same time - lets enjoy life together and stop pretending we are zombies and live those moments as gifts rather then as work..

be well

geo

Posted by: geo at May 15, 2007 03:09 PM

Jack of all trades, master of none -- that has been my career. I have a college degree, but in General Studies (minor in Business).

95% or more though is self taught. I am certain there was not a college program for what I have learned over the years and anything I typically 'want' to learn about is so new that the only way TO learn it is self-study.

Posted by: John Rath at May 15, 2007 02:39 PM

I'm self-taught. I picked up a webcam and began creating videos in early 2006. I began learning how to edit and what was required to do so. I taught myself how to use a computer and use the internet.

I learn some of the foundations of my life from school, but other than that I taught myself the rest.

Posted by: Jonathan Bloom at May 15, 2007 01:26 PM

I am self taught. The internet was my mentor in regards to learning technology, programming, etc.

Posted by: Jeff O'Hara at May 15, 2007 12:46 PM

K^2 above said: "Other than the basic building blocks of writing -- vocabulary, sentence structure, paragraph construction, etc. -- I picked up virtually nothing in 17 years of formal schooling that is of use to me today in my work."

That is pretty much my experience as well.

Posted by: valeko at May 15, 2007 12:39 PM

I have a masters degree from the school of hard knocks.

When I did decide to get an actual bachelors degree in computer information systems (which I thought would help me get a better job), I maintained a 3.7 GPA, and mostly taught the professors a thing or two (but then again, 90% of them were just there for a steady paycheck)

Growing up, I was easily bored, unless I was trying to figure out something new, but once I could see what the answer was going to be, I generally lost interest and moved on to something else.

I am the jack of all trades, and the master of a few.

Posted by: Michael Bailey at May 15, 2007 11:45 AM

Education all over the place today.

The United States school system was drastically revised by the industrial barons of the day to fit their needs. Carnegie, Rockefeller - they created a system designed to suppress individuality, curiousity, and critical thought in order to make living automatons for their factories. As I mentioned elsewhere today, check out John Taylor Gatto's book, The Underground History of American Education. It's an eye opener:

http://www.johntaylorgatto.com/underground/

And I've always learned more by forging the path myself rather than travel the road already paved.

Posted by: Christopher S. Penn at May 15, 2007 11:35 AM

I dropped out of college to start my first business, a Unix and Network consulting firm that morphed into Tucson's first commercial dialup ISP. I am thankful for many of the things I learned in school, but I am mostly thankful for the things I was exposed to such as the Internet and the computer club (HACKS).

I got a lot out of it to a point, but after that point, school interfered with my education.

I would have to say that 95% or more of what I have learned that makes me successful in this business is self-taught.

Posted by: dave siegel at May 15, 2007 11:22 AM

I have always said that I'll take street smart over book smart any day of the week.

My grades were never that great in school. I was smart but never applied myself because getting a good grade meant nothing. I just wanted to do the work and learn. Honor roll and such didn't matter.

I personally have learned more from the people around me and on the job then I ever learned in school. The problem is that the world changes too quick and schools can't keep up with that change.

Posted by: C.C. at May 15, 2007 10:15 AM

I was encouraged to pursue an accounting degree in college too. There were a lot of things wrong with the way they taught accounting in college. It was all memorization. I refused to memorize and tried to learn the theories to then be able to apply them to the problems.

That was a mistake.

I switched to management and there I was able to learn and apply knowledge to problem solving. Great stuff. One of my professor was the creator of MBO, Management By Objectives, George Ordiorne. A great guy. I learned how to teach from him... Really great stuff...

I also had a professor who was a retired Johnson and Johnson retiree. He told us that he had worked too hard in life, ignoring his family. Looking back on it, he told us to become pebbles on the shorline and take time to enjoy life and not to work so much.

As it relates to what I'm doing now, video, blogging, photography... I took two photography classes in college and an intro to Final Cut Pro class.

Other than that it's all self taught.

One thing I enjoyed was sitting with an audio editor at a radaio station I worked at, and looking over his shoulder while he worked. I did the same thing at a newspaper when I hung out with the graphic designer as he processed photos on photoshop... I think mentoring is great.

Posted by: steve garfield at May 15, 2007 10:10 AM

Other than the basic building blocks of writing -- vocabulary, sentence structure, paragraph construction, etc. -- I picked up virtually nothing in 17 years of formal schooling that is of use to me today in my work.

For the most part, previous generations had it right, employing the concept of apprenticeship combined with hard work and thown-into-the-fire-by-the-seat-of-your-pants improvisation.

Posted by: K˛ at May 15, 2007 09:53 AM

It's all OJT baby. No certifications, just hard-won experience about what works and what doesn't, and troubleshooting skills honed in the crucible of supporting high-risk, high-value financial systems, with high-strung executives on your butt asking for when it will be fixed. Of course you have to diplomatically explain that the old SNA-gateway that they refused to allocate budget for /were too scared to replace, has finally failed. The key words are "Its no longer supported by the manufacturer..."

University was a place where I was a little fish in a big pond, as opposed to High School, which was a wakeup call to me. It was also the first lesson in self-reliance and self-starting, and learning that you were in control of your own destiny for the most part.

Posted by: Craig Plunkett at May 15, 2007 09:46 AM

I've definitely learned more by tinkering with stuff on my own than by studying something in an organized manner.

Posted by: Hans Persson at May 15, 2007 09:25 AM

So far everything I used to my advantage has been something I learnt on my own: Perl, HTML, CSS, Asterisk, Linux administration, Python, Qt/KDE...

And almost none of these things are looked for in the world, sad as that is. Everything is C++, C# (neither of which I’m touching with a ten foot pole), Java (which I’m nowhere competent in), PHP (ten foot pole rule applies), you name it. I’m supposedly a better engineer if I know what O(2^n) means and if I know by heart that a certain algorithm cannot be made in less time, but I don’t think I’ve ever faced that problem so far!

Posted by: Henrik Pauli at May 15, 2007 09:12 AM

Well, I've learned mostly from my own doing, rather than school system. I think it gave me a basis, but I always invested in my personal interest. Hey - I am learning editing, shooting video, lighting, audio - and I've never studied media. Also my business career launched before I had a degree. Especially when you are talking about doing business - school can give you the basic terminology and maybe some ideas about what's out there, but without being in the trenches yourself, nothing will happen. So, if you look at what I am doing now, and on my career path - it is 5%-95% ratio, 5% school, the rest is footwork, falling and getting up again etc.

Having said that, I see a lot of value in mentors - people with experience that I can talk with and listen to their perspective of life, based on their experience. This is something I find fascinating, and lacking in the education system today.

Posted by: Kfir Pravda at May 15, 2007 08:46 AM

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